Just a thought: How about we nix Presidents’ Day and make Election Day a national holiday instead?
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@benroyce
Here in Australia where voting is mandatory it puts the onus on the government to make voting possible for everyone.
Elections happen on a Saturday, employees must be given time off to vote, there are booths available and accessible everywhere (usually the local school hall, which gives schools an opportunity to fundraise, hence the traditional "democracy sausage") and they provide pre-polling in the week leading up to the election. Generally wait times that are short enough for you to be able to vote within half an hour.
At the last election in informal votes were 5.6% of the vote. That includes dick votes, but the majority are votes where someone made a mistake (we have ranked choice voting so you need to have a valid sequence of numbers).
@nuintari @Strandjunker@stib @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker It might be worth posting a picture of some of the lengths we go to to ensure everyone can vote, no matter where you live.
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i used to disagree
that if you make voting mandatory, people will draw dicks on their ballot or do joke votes
and you do see that in places where voting is mandatory
but i've changed my view
you can't force people to care, yes
but enough say they "care" but then won't do fucking shit to prove it in an extremely effective way: by voting
so now i think getting enough of those lazy entitled assholes off their asses and voting outweighs the sabotage/ vandalism effect
@benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I am astonished how difficult the US makes it for people to vote. Having to travel long distances and then having to queue for long periods to vote.
And running it on a working day when many people simply can’t get the time off to vote -
i used to disagree
that if you make voting mandatory, people will draw dicks on their ballot or do joke votes
and you do see that in places where voting is mandatory
but i've changed my view
you can't force people to care, yes
but enough say they "care" but then won't do fucking shit to prove it in an extremely effective way: by voting
so now i think getting enough of those lazy entitled assholes off their asses and voting outweighs the sabotage/ vandalism effect
Meh, people voting who have no clue who to vote for will just go where the wealthy pay to lead them. Some boring rich white man with a pasty fake smile and a perfect family... again.
CC: @nuintari@bsd.cafe @Strandjunker@mstdn.social -
@daveburb @Lats @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker most people vote early now. It's much easier to pop past an early polling booth than deal with the polling day crowds (queues can be more than 10 minutes on polling day! Unpossible!)
@moz @daveburb @Lats @nuintari @Strandjunker
all the australians and #newzealand ers in the replies talking about their #votingsystem s:
i would feel remiss if i didn't repost #thejuicemedia video that made me fall in love with #australia (i love you too kiwis, please don't laser eye me)
(note for americans: what australians call #preferentialvoting we call #rankedchoicevoting)
you want this too americans?
THEN #VOTE, YOU LAZY ENTITLED WHINY ASSHOLES
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@twobiscuits @Lats @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker Last three general elections in NZ I've voted at:
offical voting station, in my district;
pop-up voting station in a train station concourse, outside my district, on my way to work;
pop-up voting station in a shopping mall, outside my district, on my lunch break.
All of these stations had the full hardcopy voter roll for the entire metropolitan area of >1.5 million people. If you were from further away you could still submit your vote, but it would go in an outer envelope to your home town where it would be counted.@rupert @twobiscuits @Lats @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker voting at the NZ embassy in Sydney was similarly easy. They had signs on the footpath and all the way up to the 20th floor, then a very efficient system for actually voting. Good enough that I don't remember it because it was so quick and easy.
Voting is important to the governments of Oz and NZ, they *want* people to vote.
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@benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I am astonished how difficult the US makes it for people to vote. Having to travel long distances and then having to queue for long periods to vote.
And running it on a working day when many people simply can’t get the time off to vote@peterbrown @nuintari @Strandjunker
that's by design
and lazy asshole americans respond by just giving up
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@benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I am astonished how difficult the US makes it for people to vote. Having to travel long distances and then having to queue for long periods to vote.
And running it on a working day when many people simply can’t get the time off to vote@peterbrown @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I periodically suggesting using "percentage of the population who vote" as a measure of how democratic a country is.
By that measure the US falls from "at risk democracy" to "somewhat democratic", but amusingly Aotearoa with optional voting matches Australia with compulsory because it lets more people vote.
It's contentious because to most people not letting everyone vote is just obvious common sense
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@Strandjunker or you could vote on Saturday or Sunday like the rest of the civilised world
@xgebi @Strandjunker Except, they don't usually have the sunday off ... like (most of) the rest of the world.... mh
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@benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I am astonished how difficult the US makes it for people to vote. Having to travel long distances and then having to queue for long periods to vote.
And running it on a working day when many people simply can’t get the time off to vote@peterbrown @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I can't believe that you have to register to vote, and that you have to keep checking if you are still registered to vote!
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@fruitcakesareyum
The article I linked has a few details about that but for more info here's a link to the FAQ for Oregon elections website. I attached a screenshot of that specific section.@ahimsa_pdx @fruitcakesareyum That seems a good measure to keep your vote private from poll workers.
It looks like the onus is entirely on the voter to keep it private from say family, and I can see that being difficult for some people in abusive relationships for instance.
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@peterbrown @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I can't believe that you have to register to vote, and that you have to keep checking if you are still registered to vote!
@rhempel @peterbrown @nuintari @Strandjunker
that's called voter suppression. "register to vote" is indeed an artificial hoop we have to jump through
combined with other voter suppression methods we see republicans winning by tiny fractions in some elections that would otherwise go the other way. some obvious big elections come to mind
the problem to me though is how many americans don't know/ don't care about what is being done to them, or even cynically giving up and accepting their abuse
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@xgebi @Strandjunker Except, they don't usually have the sunday off ... like (most of) the rest of the world.... mh
@hackbyte @Strandjunker so they can schedule it on both days of the weekend with long hours. Oh, wait, that would be communism if everyone was encouraged and enabled to go vote.
I rest my case and stay on my side of the border.
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@Lats @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker In Graz, Austria. When there's an election, we have >270 voting places in the city. That's for a total population of about 300k or around 200 k eligible voters. Your voting place is right around the corner. And you can still mail it in if you like.
@Lats @benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker Each polling station is run by volunteers, nominated by the parties. They do the initial count on the spot which results in rapid collation of the results. The ballot papers are kept and can be reviewed by officials if necessary. But I think it's a shrewd idea for grassroots ppl from 4 or 5 parties to sit together and decide which ballots are valid, double count the piles etc. It's an unspectacular way of avoiding fighting about alleged voter fraud, etc. As a party, you basically had your person there.
Btw, elections are always on Sundays.
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Meh, people voting who have no clue who to vote for will just go where the wealthy pay to lead them. Some boring rich white man with a pasty fake smile and a perfect family... again.
CC: @nuintari@bsd.cafe @Strandjunker@mstdn.socialI'd like to improve education, and access to voting. Anyone preventing it from being easy and quick is an enemy of democracy. Your curmudgeonly boss loses his right to exist card when he grumpily coincidentally makes it so you don't have time to vote. But that includes learning about the candidates, and spending time attacking the people publishing fraudulent propaganda. And also limiting campaign contributions. If we can guarantee all that, then maybe democracy stands a chance.
Whether the vote is mandatory doesn't seem like... as much of a big deal. Sure go ahead I don't think it'll change things much, but if voting is accessible and easy, then there's no problem making people do it. Maybe it's a chicken and egg thing?
CC: @nuintari@bsd.cafe @Strandjunker@mstdn.social @benroyce@mastodon.social -
i used to disagree
that if you make voting mandatory, people will draw dicks on their ballot or do joke votes
and you do see that in places where voting is mandatory
but i've changed my view
you can't force people to care, yes
but enough say they "care" but then won't do fucking shit to prove it in an extremely effective way: by voting
so now i think getting enough of those lazy entitled assholes off their asses and voting outweighs the sabotage/ vandalism effect
@benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker Mandatory voting is less to get people who won't vote to do so, but more to get those who would suppress the vote to fuck off forever.
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@benroyce @nuintari @Strandjunker I am astonished how difficult the US makes it for people to vote. Having to travel long distances and then having to queue for long periods to vote.
And running it on a working day when many people simply can’t get the time off to vote@peterbrown @benroyce @nuintari In recent years Michigan has gone all-in on making it *easier* to vote. E.g. at every interaction w/ the state, you'll be asked if you want to register to vote. (Also no-reason absentee ballots, etc.) Trump's DOJ launched a bogus investigation on grounds there were "too many" registered voters. No, this is what it looks like when the gov't *wants* people to vote! But Republicans hate that.
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@twobiscuits @benroyce @peterbrown @nuintari @Strandjunker That's pretty much how it works in Canada here - you get mail at your home address that says you are registered and you bring that and an ID and vote. It's not that hard.
Anything else is open to abuse and voter suppression, which I suspect has more impact than voter fraud ...
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@benroyce @Strandjunker I think voting needs to be a two day affair, with a mandated time off for everyone.
So places like hospitals can schedule.
@nuintari @benroyce @Strandjunker yes, but when people vote, right-wing policies always lose.
by the numbers.
the more people vote, the left-wing-ier the outcome is.
So guess who'll never, ever, allow that to come to pass.
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@twobiscuits @benroyce @rhempel @peterbrown @nuintari @Strandjunker If you did not have people register to vote, how would you prevent people from just touring the city and voting at each polling station? Whichever party cheats best wins in that case.
I suppose we could use the purple finger method. In Iraq, where most of the vital records were destroyed, you had to dunk your finger in purple ink that takes a couple days to wear off.
Yes you should have to show ID at a polling station.
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@twobiscuits @benroyce @rhempel @peterbrown @nuintari @Strandjunker If you did not have people register to vote, how would you prevent people from just touring the city and voting at each polling station? Whichever party cheats best wins in that case.
I suppose we could use the purple finger method. In Iraq, where most of the vital records were destroyed, you had to dunk your finger in purple ink that takes a couple days to wear off.
Yes you should have to show ID at a polling station.
@mike805 @twobiscuits @benroyce @peterbrown @nuintari @Strandjunker You have to register, of course, but it should be automatic when you move to a new location.
I think the difference is whether you have to explicitly register to vote, or if the government recognizes your new location either by a change of address on the driver's license , or your tax forms, etc.
It should be easy to get added to a voting roll.
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