What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
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@malte @Slacker because you don't buy a car to tweak the engine until you know how the car works first. Then you learn about the engine. Then you tweak it.
Many 'noobs' are mad there isn't a bolt-on upgrade to rice it. i.e. a double-click method and that it takes some learning.
At least, this is the experience I've had, and so I just don't bother helping anymore.
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@Linux_in_a_Bit It might sound simple and I am aware people often volunteer but not getting a reply after hours of waiting is even for me as a nerd very frustrating. At least after a while have someone say "sorry it seems we can't help you either. Maybe you can leave a ticket on our tracker/mailinglist" or something along those lines. That often would have made me feel better than the feeling of being ignored or worse feeling I asked something so stupid nobody wants to talk to me.
@mtrnord @Linux_in_a_Bit as frustrating as that is, it helps to remember people that do help are global and probably not in your time zone.
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@malte @Slacker because you don't buy a car to tweak the engine until you know how the car works first. Then you learn about the engine. Then you tweak it.
Many 'noobs' are mad there isn't a bolt-on upgrade to rice it. i.e. a double-click method and that it takes some learning.
At least, this is the experience I've had, and so I just don't bother helping anymore.
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
Seconded. It's been said that Apple hates computers but loves users, and that Linux hates users but loves computers. There's room for everyone at the console. Death to the elitist penguin.
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit Another common thing I've encountered is feeling like people aren't really listening to you or aren't willing to take the time to understand the situation before they start throwing stuff at you.
This is sometimes how people recommend Linux itself, as a solution to a problem in a situation where switching to Linux would either be unfeasible or where that'd cause a lot more headache than simply finding a workaround for now and look into switching to linux at a later date when you're not actively trying to solve a problem.
A lot of these issues, I feel like, come from an inability a lot of people have to admit they don't know something. That's why they feel the need to make it out like you're the one wrong for asking the question, or try and steer them towards something you do have an expertise in even if that thing isn't actually helpful in the situation.
No reasonable person is gonna think less if you just admit you don't know. "I don't know, but I'll try looking into it" is a lot better than bullshitting some answer or deflecting the question. And when it comes to computers in particular, I'm pretty convinced there are only two kinds of people: people who don't know what they are doing at least half the time and people who are lying.
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@Linux_in_a_Bit not true anymore.
With AI integrated in most search engine, you often get the right response from it.
One of the few benefits of AI is that it can basically customise the documentation to make it sensible to you. It becomes a kind of live documentation.A simple how to fix … on [distro name] works 95% of the time in my experience.
@CedC @Linux_in_a_Bit Or… consider this: it also often hallucinates complete bullshit.
No, LLMs are not a solution. -
@Linux_in_a_Bit Offer to pay for it maybe vOv
I hear you. I've been frustrated too. But you're asking people to share expertise for free when they honestly have already shared a whole crap ton of it.
Maybe people who can't understand that should stick to the proprietary platforms who are willing to monetize your soul as collateral instead.
@crazyeddie @Linux_in_a_Bit And TBF, a good many people still do it. It may not be the typical online experience and there's surely room to improve, but I wouldn't even know where to find a seasoned Windows or Mac expert who'll sit down with you in person and show you how to fix your IT problems for free, something that is often advertised by Linux user groups.
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit half the replies to this post
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit Asking for help with Windows doesn't really work much better. I think the problem is people in general, not Linux people specifically.
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit One thing that I guess hasn't changed much in 20 years....
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit i joined a forum I had to because i'm an idiot. My complaint about Linux is that my computer looks exactly the same. I have mint it's terribly boring. Lol
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit The replies to this post about Linux for the normal computer user are very on-brand.
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@Linux_in_a_Bit
Another big issue is the intense use of jargon in replies to questions. Sure, it's a faster way to get information from your brain onto a forum, but a new user to Ubuntu is not going to understand it, and isn't likely to go looking up every third word.@Bwaz @Linux_in_a_Bit yes! I always have kind replies when I ask for help, but I don't understand most of them
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit The primary reason i bought a system76 pre-installed laptop for my initial transition was the "create a ticket" button it has in the settings. Nice people who get paid to help me help me when i push it and give me copy-pasteable terminal commands by email.
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What's the most common complaint I've heard about Linux?
Not the installation process.
Not finding a distro.
Not getting programs to work.
Not troubleshooting.
Not hardware compatibility.The most common complaint about Linux I've seen is this:
For a normal computer user, asking for help is just about impossible.They ask a simple question and:
People respond "Did you Google it?"
People respond "RTFM"
People get mad??? at them for making an easy mistake.We can't expect people to know to, or even know how to deal with any of that stuff.
Search engines these days are awful, manuals are hard to read for most people (especially stuff like ArchWiki), and normal people make mistakes we think are easily avoidable.
The solution to making Linux more popular is not ruthless promotion. The solution is to actually help the people who are trying to use it.
@Linux_in_a_Bit
A lot of subject matter experts think it is beneath them to explain something simple to a new user, and maybe even get off on making fun of them. I speak from experience, as someone who was that asshole in my younger days. A key difference between a junior vs a senior dev is not so much skill or knowledge, as mentoring other devs, helping them learn.
Saying "RTFM" is often unhelpful, whereas an actual link to TFM and maybe a section or page number might be helpful. -
@Linux_in_a_Bit
A lot of subject matter experts think it is beneath them to explain something simple to a new user, and maybe even get off on making fun of them. I speak from experience, as someone who was that asshole in my younger days. A key difference between a junior vs a senior dev is not so much skill or knowledge, as mentoring other devs, helping them learn.
Saying "RTFM" is often unhelpful, whereas an actual link to TFM and maybe a section or page number might be helpful.@Linux_in_a_Bit
Certainly teaching new users how to find the answers is worthwhile, but that isn't just saying RTFM. One can give an answer or pointer, AND help them learn how to find things on their own.
Being rude to new users doesn't impress anyone, other than other assholes who like to be rude to new users. -
@Linux_in_a_Bit
Certainly teaching new users how to find the answers is worthwhile, but that isn't just saying RTFM. One can give an answer or pointer, AND help them learn how to find things on their own.
Being rude to new users doesn't impress anyone, other than other assholes who like to be rude to new users.@Linux_in_a_Bit
Sometimes a new user has a question for which it is obvious that there is no simple answer that they're likely to understand. It is possible to politely explain why, and still provide pointers to resources that might, if sufficiently studied, actually answer their question.
Sometimes a new user wants to know how to do something that simply is not possible in any practical way. Again, it's possible to politely explain that. -
@Linux_in_a_Bit
Sometimes a new user has a question for which it is obvious that there is no simple answer that they're likely to understand. It is possible to politely explain why, and still provide pointers to resources that might, if sufficiently studied, actually answer their question.
Sometimes a new user wants to know how to do something that simply is not possible in any practical way. Again, it's possible to politely explain that.@Linux_in_a_Bit
None of us were born experts on Linux, or on any aspect of computing. We all had to learn it, though our individual paths varied. Perhaps some of us have forgotten how frustrating that was at times.
Saying RTFM in a smug and condescending way benefits no one. -
Nice meet you too...
It was just an opinion mate...
And the folk who escaped the toxicity of X, Facebook, etc, etc to the, supposedly, more moderate Mastodon just love reading post's like your reply.
Oh, and, fuck you dickhead!
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Fair enough.
Not really my fault though.
And, where I'm from, "mate' is a non-gendered term of de-escalation.
Oh, and, are you complaining about the toxicity of the "Linux Community", or providing an example of it?
