US states should start withholding federal tax money because it is, in fact, taxation without representation all over again -- just internal rather than external this time.
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@codinghorror once you unpack how the U.S. system actually works, the situation is more complex. if states were to start withholding federal taxes, it would amount to de facto nullification or fiscal secession, which would trigger immediate constitutional crisis I guess.
@vivante again, the state is not a party to the transaction so there is no mechanical way for them to withhold federal taxes.
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@vivante again, the state is not a party to the transaction so there is no mechanical way for them to withhold federal taxes.
@joeld I think in the US it is more like an information gap. that is exactly what the data shows but I am outside the US so maybe I am wrong with that.
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@joeld I think in the US it is more like an information gap. that is exactly what the data shows but I am outside the US so maybe I am wrong with that.
@vivante when you say “it is more like an information gap” what is the “it” in that sentence?
More generally, when my business files a federal income tax return with the IRS and the business owes taxes, the IRS then withdraws the owed money directly from the business bank account and it goes into the US Treasury. (Same process for individual income taxes.) Where does the state ever have an opportunity of intervening in this transaction?
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@vivante when you say “it is more like an information gap” what is the “it” in that sentence?
More generally, when my business files a federal income tax return with the IRS and the business owes taxes, the IRS then withdraws the owed money directly from the business bank account and it goes into the US Treasury. (Same process for individual income taxes.) Where does the state ever have an opportunity of intervening in this transaction?
@joeld In the absence of a "mechanical" middleman like a payroll department, the state’s opportunity to intervene shifts from the start of the transaction to its residue. It = transaction
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@joeld In the absence of a "mechanical" middleman like a payroll department, the state’s opportunity to intervene shifts from the start of the transaction to its residue. It = transaction
@vivante I freely admit I do not understand what you are saying. The state government never handles or holds monies owed to the federal government so they have no way to withhold those monies.
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@vivante I freely admit I do not understand what you are saying. The state government never handles or holds monies owed to the federal government so they have no way to withhold those monies.
@joeld It is largely true that the current financial infrastructure of the US is designed to keep state and federal money in separate "lanes." but it seems that under Trump there are no "normal" operations anymore. My view from outside the US.
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@joeld It is largely true that the current financial infrastructure of the US is designed to keep state and federal money in separate "lanes." but it seems that under Trump there are no "normal" operations anymore. My view from outside the US.
@vivante ok well that’s like saying the current financial structure is designed to keep your grocer’s money and your lawyer’s money in separate lanes. There is no such “design”; there simply was never any reason to mingle those monies. nothing about the way we pay taxes has changed.
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@vivante ok well that’s like saying the current financial structure is designed to keep your grocer’s money and your lawyer’s money in separate lanes. There is no such “design”; there simply was never any reason to mingle those monies. nothing about the way we pay taxes has changed.
@joeld t looks dramatic from the outside
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