current thoughts after experimenting with some proposed discord alternatives recently:matrix: despite the honourable efforts of instance maintainers, i actually think that client apps are the achilles heel of matrix.
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@Jes honestly i just don't think federation is a great fit for a community chat app. this may be a controversial take, but i'm actually perfectly happy with the independent silos provided by teamspeak, mumble, and almost all game servers. i don't really think retaining the rooms and members of dead servers is particularly useful, and i think attempting to build software that carries the burden of everyone else's activity like that in the first place was asking for trouble.
@ari the only real way to do federation in chat apps is probably more like XMPP where it's a burden of the user to store chat logs -
@alexia i've edited my post to correct that statement. it was definitely wrong of me to lean on that assumption without reading deeper. i was unaware of this blog post at the time and kinda rushed a surface-level evaluation of fluxer as i already wasn't a huge fan of the "discord-like" model.
that's definitely a blunder on my part, and i think the best thing i can do is give it a better chance so i can evaluate it more fairly. i'll likely make a successor to this original post when i have a greater idea of the options available, with fluxer as a particular point of interest!oh, ty!! not sure if the edit federated only after I replied or if it was bad timing on my part
ty nonetheless!
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@ari the only real way to do federation in chat apps is probably more like XMPP where it's a burden of the user to store chat logs@ari but yeah connecting directly to servers for chats seems to be the most efficient way of doing it if chat history is a concern
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@fiore fwiw, while looking into matrix hosting, i found that a webRTC connection over relays (see TURN) was the preferred method of setting up VOIP.
while it would sidestep stock mumble quite substantially, if the architecture is designed to be extensible enough, i don't see why a mumble server couldn't just negotiate a relay link between participants to support even a simple video feed!ithink murmur supporting smth like that could be cool yes
or even just . a standalone thing webrtc server , which then the client implementation could make appear as tho they were part of the same interface . idk mumble is so cool and simple , you could pretty much have a full discord replacement if you mesh mumble irc and webrtc in the right way
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@ari@fedi.arimelody.space When I started looking into it, I thought self hosting and encryption being annoying would be the main issue with matrix, but it's 100% the clients, they're fine but dear god it's not something I could use long term
@ghost_desu i was genuinely surprised how much the onus was on clients. really ringing home that the FOSS space has more backend developers than frontend designers
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@ari but yeah connecting directly to servers for chats seems to be the most efficient way of doing it if chat history is a concern
@Jes and perfectly sensible for 99% of what people use a community chat platform for- even on discord, where albeit outages are very infrequent, it's not the end of the world if our node goes down for a little while.
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oh, ty!! not sure if the edit federated only after I replied or if it was bad timing on my part
ty nonetheless!
@alexia i edited around the same time, no worries! regardless, i'll be taking more time to look into fluxer properly, following this.
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ithink murmur supporting smth like that could be cool yes
or even just . a standalone thing webrtc server , which then the client implementation could make appear as tho they were part of the same interface . idk mumble is so cool and simple , you could pretty much have a full discord replacement if you mesh mumble irc and webrtc in the right way@fiore oh yeah, to be clear, making it feel integrated would 100% be part of the plan there
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@fiore oh yeah, to be clear, making it feel integrated would 100% be part of the plan there
tbh i like the idea of murmur being minimal as a server , thats what makes it cool and easy to host
but yea like whatever im making a nothingburger here its not like im gonna go and implement this myself , i should NOT be allowed near ui code
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tbh i like the idea of murmur being minimal as a server , thats what makes it cool and easy to host
but yea like whatever im making a nothingburger here its not like im gonna go and implement this myself , i should NOT be allowed near ui code -
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