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  3. I may regret this at some point, but I felt the need to put down in writing how I feel about this moment in the tech industry.

I may regret this at some point, but I felt the need to put down in writing how I feel about this moment in the tech industry.

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llmprogramming
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  • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

    I may regret this at some point, but I felt the need to put down in writing how I feel about this moment in the tech industry.

    It is not kind. You may well be insulted by it. If you are... then you really should question yourself.

    https://www.garfieldtech.com/blog/selfish-ai

    #AI #LLM #Programming

    Stefan KoopmanschapS This user is from outside of this forum
    Stefan KoopmanschapS This user is from outside of this forum
    Stefan Koopmanschap
    wrote last edited by
    #7

    @Crell thanks. Excellent way to put this into words. I mostly agree with this

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • krigK krig

      @Crell Here's something that rubs me the wrong way: "At some point soon, I will have to figure out how to work with AI coding tools" - No, you don't. That's a choice you are making. In the end, you are making the same choice as those who say "It is what it is". You choose personal convenience over your convictions. Someone has to be the first to refuse. Someone has to be the one to shoulder the burden. What makes you think that someone isn't you?

      J This user is from outside of this forum
      J This user is from outside of this forum
      Justin Macleod
      wrote last edited by
      #8

      @krig @Crell While I don't disagree, that's a huge ask. If someone does a thing to pay the bils and everyone else is doing that thing faster with AI, those "convictions" could land them and their family without pay or benefits. That's a big gun to stare down the barrel of. That's the fear. That's what needs to be addressed. It may well be a false narrative, time will tell, but it's a big leep of faith to ask anyone to take.

      Piggleston PecanpantsL 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • J Justin Macleod

        @krig @Crell While I don't disagree, that's a huge ask. If someone does a thing to pay the bils and everyone else is doing that thing faster with AI, those "convictions" could land them and their family without pay or benefits. That's a big gun to stare down the barrel of. That's the fear. That's what needs to be addressed. It may well be a false narrative, time will tell, but it's a big leep of faith to ask anyone to take.

        Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
        Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
        Piggleston Pecanpants
        wrote last edited by
        #9

        @JustinMac84 Meanwhile they could be learning something else in their free time that will be minimumly affected by A.I. so if the hammer comes down they have an option to turn to. It's not all or nothing. @krig @Crell

        Larry GarfieldC 1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • Piggleston PecanpantsL Piggleston Pecanpants

          @JustinMac84 Meanwhile they could be learning something else in their free time that will be minimumly affected by A.I. so if the hammer comes down they have an option to turn to. It's not all or nothing. @krig @Crell

          Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
          Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
          Larry Garfield
          wrote last edited by
          #10

          @LilPecan @JustinMac84 @krig Quoting the article: "But, at this point, it's become obvious that I have to either compromise on that, or leave tech entirely. And every time I think about that, I get angry."

          Leaving my field and starting over from scratch while I have a small child at home is... a large ask.

          Piggleston PecanpantsL 1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • Alerta! Alerta!H Alerta! Alerta!

            @Crell Thank you for putting my thoughts into such elaborate words!

            The challenge I see is that - especially after COVID - we are now living in a world of "Me" instead of a world of "We".

            Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
            Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
            Larry Garfield
            wrote last edited by
            #11

            @heiglandreas That's been building for 50 years. Every conservative businessman in the 70s that decided to embark on this decade long destruction of the world so they could get even richer.

            There is no circle of hell deep enough for them.

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

              I may regret this at some point, but I felt the need to put down in writing how I feel about this moment in the tech industry.

              It is not kind. You may well be insulted by it. If you are... then you really should question yourself.

              https://www.garfieldtech.com/blog/selfish-ai

              #AI #LLM #Programming

              Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
              Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
              Larry Garfield
              wrote last edited by
              #12

              Apparently this post was just boosted by @robpike. Yes, that Rob Pike.

              I... guess it's found an audience.

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

                @LilPecan @JustinMac84 @krig Quoting the article: "But, at this point, it's become obvious that I have to either compromise on that, or leave tech entirely. And every time I think about that, I get angry."

                Leaving my field and starting over from scratch while I have a small child at home is... a large ask.

                Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                Piggleston Pecanpants
                wrote last edited by
                #13

                @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig Yes. I had a job that was ethically questionable and faced the same dilemma. All I'm suggesting is you might use part of your nights and weekends to learn something different, something AI resistant, to have as a backup when this all falls apart. Also, by being productive in an unfamiliar arena, it may distract you and lessen your angst. You'll be doing something positive to educate yourself instead of just letting guilt wash over you.

                Larry GarfieldC MarianneN 2 Replies Last reply
                0
                • Piggleston PecanpantsL Piggleston Pecanpants

                  @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig Yes. I had a job that was ethically questionable and faced the same dilemma. All I'm suggesting is you might use part of your nights and weekends to learn something different, something AI resistant, to have as a backup when this all falls apart. Also, by being productive in an unfamiliar arena, it may distract you and lessen your angst. You'll be doing something positive to educate yourself instead of just letting guilt wash over you.

                  Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
                  Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
                  Larry Garfield
                  wrote last edited by
                  #14

                  @LilPecan @JustinMac84 @krig You seem to be under the impression that the hammer hasn't come down yet. I'm currently unemployed, at a super-senior level. The hammer is here.

                  *Nothing* is AI resistant that pays worth a damn.

                  Piggleston PecanpantsL 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

                    @LilPecan @JustinMac84 @krig You seem to be under the impression that the hammer hasn't come down yet. I'm currently unemployed, at a super-senior level. The hammer is here.

                    *Nothing* is AI resistant that pays worth a damn.

                    Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                    Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                    Piggleston Pecanpants
                    wrote last edited by
                    #15

                    @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig And that's also a problem related to the big picture of why this is happening: greed. If people would rather buy cheap crap from exploited, impoverished countries then your wood workers, leather smiths, jewelers and other manual artists, that can't be replaced by AI, can't afford to survive. So kiss artistry and beauty goodbye. That's the world silicone valley wanted and got.

                    Larry GarfieldC 1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • Piggleston PecanpantsL Piggleston Pecanpants

                      @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig And that's also a problem related to the big picture of why this is happening: greed. If people would rather buy cheap crap from exploited, impoverished countries then your wood workers, leather smiths, jewelers and other manual artists, that can't be replaced by AI, can't afford to survive. So kiss artistry and beauty goodbye. That's the world silicone valley wanted and got.

                      Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
                      Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
                      Larry Garfield
                      wrote last edited by
                      #16

                      @LilPecan @JustinMac84 @krig As a hobbyist woodworker, bladesmith, and leatherworker, I can confirm.

                      Some of the absolute best bladesmiths on the planet, that make absolutely gorgeous works of art, make good money but less than I made in my last 2 jobs as an engineer. And I am not as good an engineer as they are blade artists.

                      Piggleston PecanpantsL 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

                        @LilPecan @JustinMac84 @krig As a hobbyist woodworker, bladesmith, and leatherworker, I can confirm.

                        Some of the absolute best bladesmiths on the planet, that make absolutely gorgeous works of art, make good money but less than I made in my last 2 jobs as an engineer. And I am not as good an engineer as they are blade artists.

                        Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                        Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                        Piggleston Pecanpants
                        wrote last edited by
                        #17

                        @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig See? So you're not a one trick pony. Those are all skills that hold great value for when the end of the world arrives. When the manufacturing plants shut down because there is no more water and the world is on fire, you'll last longer than many.

                        MarianneN 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

                          I may regret this at some point, but I felt the need to put down in writing how I feel about this moment in the tech industry.

                          It is not kind. You may well be insulted by it. If you are... then you really should question yourself.

                          https://www.garfieldtech.com/blog/selfish-ai

                          #AI #LLM #Programming

                          Ayush Agarwal (आयुष अग्रवाल)A This user is from outside of this forum
                          Ayush Agarwal (आयुष अग्रवाल)A This user is from outside of this forum
                          Ayush Agarwal (आयुष अग्रवाल)
                          wrote last edited by
                          #18

                          @Crell I posted something similar yesterday and read your blog post a few moments ago. I'm glad to see someone else recognising the sheer apathy from people using LLMs who apparently "cared" about FOSS, which seems like horseshit at this point.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • MarianneN Marianne shared this topic
                          • Piggleston PecanpantsL Piggleston Pecanpants

                            @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig Yes. I had a job that was ethically questionable and faced the same dilemma. All I'm suggesting is you might use part of your nights and weekends to learn something different, something AI resistant, to have as a backup when this all falls apart. Also, by being productive in an unfamiliar arena, it may distract you and lessen your angst. You'll be doing something positive to educate yourself instead of just letting guilt wash over you.

                            MarianneN This user is from outside of this forum
                            MarianneN This user is from outside of this forum
                            Marianne
                            wrote last edited by
                            #19

                            @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig @LilPecan what do you think is "AI-resistant" right now? Genuine q

                            J 1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • Piggleston PecanpantsL Piggleston Pecanpants

                              @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig See? So you're not a one trick pony. Those are all skills that hold great value for when the end of the world arrives. When the manufacturing plants shut down because there is no more water and the world is on fire, you'll last longer than many.

                              MarianneN This user is from outside of this forum
                              MarianneN This user is from outside of this forum
                              Marianne
                              wrote last edited by
                              #20

                              @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig @LilPecan what do we do in this meantime before the world ends? What do we do to live every day that isn't being corroded by AI slop and boosters?

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • MarianneN Marianne

                                @Crell @JustinMac84 @krig @LilPecan what do you think is "AI-resistant" right now? Genuine q

                                J This user is from outside of this forum
                                J This user is from outside of this forum
                                Justin Macleod
                                wrote last edited by
                                #21

                                @noodlemaz @Crell @krig @LilPecan Manual labour, hospitality that is face to face. Anything that needs a pair of hands and can't be done remotely by a bot pretending to be a person.

                                MarianneN 1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • J Justin Macleod

                                  @noodlemaz @Crell @krig @LilPecan Manual labour, hospitality that is face to face. Anything that needs a pair of hands and can't be done remotely by a bot pretending to be a person.

                                  MarianneN This user is from outside of this forum
                                  MarianneN This user is from outside of this forum
                                  Marianne
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #22

                                  @Crell @krig @LilPecan @JustinMac84 ah yes so many jobs going in those areas
                                  Hospitality isn't suffering or anything

                                  Sure my PhD will come in handy there too

                                  Piggleston PecanpantsL 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

                                    I may regret this at some point, but I felt the need to put down in writing how I feel about this moment in the tech industry.

                                    It is not kind. You may well be insulted by it. If you are... then you really should question yourself.

                                    https://www.garfieldtech.com/blog/selfish-ai

                                    #AI #LLM #Programming

                                    Avi Rappoport (avirr)A This user is from outside of this forum
                                    Avi Rappoport (avirr)A This user is from outside of this forum
                                    Avi Rappoport (avirr)
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #23

                                    @Crell AI ate my job

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • Larry GarfieldC Larry Garfield

                                      I may regret this at some point, but I felt the need to put down in writing how I feel about this moment in the tech industry.

                                      It is not kind. You may well be insulted by it. If you are... then you really should question yourself.

                                      https://www.garfieldtech.com/blog/selfish-ai

                                      #AI #LLM #Programming

                                      nebulosN This user is from outside of this forum
                                      nebulosN This user is from outside of this forum
                                      nebulos
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #24

                                      @Crell I found it interesting that you had a section on collective action - I was expecting you to talk about collective action as a solution where individual boycotts are insufficient. There are a lot of people who do see the downsides of AI - they just happen to not be the people with the power to make decisions - but collective action is how you change that.

                                      Larry GarfieldC 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • nebulosN nebulos

                                        @Crell I found it interesting that you had a section on collective action - I was expecting you to talk about collective action as a solution where individual boycotts are insufficient. There are a lot of people who do see the downsides of AI - they just happen to not be the people with the power to make decisions - but collective action is how you change that.

                                        Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
                                        Larry GarfieldC This user is from outside of this forum
                                        Larry Garfield
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #25

                                        @nebulos I wasn't really focused on solutions. More cathartic venting.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • MarianneN Marianne

                                          @Crell @krig @LilPecan @JustinMac84 ah yes so many jobs going in those areas
                                          Hospitality isn't suffering or anything

                                          Sure my PhD will come in handy there too

                                          Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                                          Piggleston PecanpantsL This user is from outside of this forum
                                          Piggleston Pecanpants
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #26

                                          @noodlemaz @Crell @krig @JustinMac84 You wouldn't be the first bartender with a PhD. If you can get into a fine dining establishment you will be surprised at what you can earn.

                                          MarianneN 1 Reply Last reply
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