PS. With all the Discord stuff, in case you wonder why you never see me promoting Matrix, it’s not because it’s a usability nightmare (which it is) but because it’s made by the kind of people who’d be happy to call ICE a customer.

@MisuseCase @aral @element Oh, you don't have any arguments left?

@aral@mastodon.ar.al @element@mastodon.matrix.org Meh, at least its open source.. As long as there is no better alternative for the features I'd rather use self-hosted matrix then discord.

P.S. Discord is also used by fascists.

@freediverx @mpsi @aral @element Other countries don’t do good things or bad things solely because of America.

Like, Britain being a racist ex-colonial power with a hell of a lot of classism is not due to America, for sure.

@sotolf @LukefromDC @aral @element
I’m not qualified to answer that question, but given the organization’s philosophical roots, I suspect they made infrastructure decisions based on risk analysis assumptions that may no longer be valid.

If that’s the case, perhaps they’re already considering ways to adapt to the changjng political environment.

@freediverx @MisuseCase @aral @element We won't become independent if we keep treating anything that happens in the US as some kind of the only possible future for ourselves.

And that is what I advocate even in this thread.

But in practice it’s the same as mastodon and activitypub. Element has a huge market share and thus influence in the matrix space. Never mind the historical ties. (2/2)

@MisuseCase @davidgerard @aral @precariousmind @element I’m not sure what you mean by coding platform.

Element develops home server applications and client applications based on Matrix protocol. Sort of like how mastadon is to activitypub.
And they sell enterprise SaaS and support for these products as their business model. You can for example use conduit as the homeserver and lots of client apps. You then are not using element’s products but using matrix. (1/2)

@mpsi @aral @element
Can you cite some larger countries where that isn’t the case? And can we agree that capital can become controlled by either oligarchs or an authoritarian government?

@prma It sounds like it might be a little different from the relationship between Mastodon and ActivityPub but okay.

@MisuseCase @mpsi @aral @element
Well that’s a case of the tail wagging the dog because the US is merely the modern day iteration of the British empire. The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree.

@MisuseCase Well activitypub is the protocol. So is matrix.
My point is that matrix without element could be a very viable solution in a few years. Maybe not just right now.

@MisuseCase@twit.social @aral@mastodon.ar.al @element@mastodon.matrix.org @precariousmind@neopaquita.es a laptop

@mpsi @MisuseCase @aral @element
One’s intentions can be noble while still adopting the wrong strategies to achieve them.

I used to use Western Europe as a good example of the many ways we could be better but now that example is fading.

@freediverx @aral @element Capital is just one of the resources that are controlled by the political elite (or political body of citizens in actually democratic countries), and which can be used by them for their gains. At least this is my point of view.

@SuperDicq quick question: do you know if this includes the apk distributed on their website? i know it complains about lack of google play services but is that just a hardcoded thing on that build or does it actually have google play services (i assume its probably the latter)

@freediverx @aral @element Let's talk some more about China - I happen to know a little bit about this country from my personal experience of living there for quite a long time. Capital in China is clearly subordinated to the decisions of the Communist Party. There is simply no way that pure "capital" will give anyone political power there. In the contrary, there are many examples of successful "capitalists" being removed from any political influence just because the Party said so.

@freediverx @aral @element No capitalist in China wields any influence over the actions of the police, unless the CPC sees their actions as aligned with its own goals.

@sotolf @LukefromDC @aral @element
I don’t recall using the word “trust”. I’m inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt given the apparent ideology of their founder and the company’s track record for security and privacy.

I would readily change my stance in the face of evidence to the contrary. I certainly don’t support their branching out into AI.

@freediverx@mastodon.social

Lots of insults, zero facts or arguments

@aral@mastodon.ar.al @element@mastodon.matrix.org

@mpsi @aral @element
Something they should be commended for. I don’t support any degree of authoritarianism or suppression of civil liberties, but the Chinese people seem to have enjoyed enormous improvements to their standard of living and quality of life. And I don’t recall China employing gunboat diplomacy like the US.