The US is threatening #Canada (again) if we don't buy their F-35s.

@alessandro @elasticsoul Stop talking for a minute and focus on what my underlying point is: the F-35 is struggling to compete with a plane designed 50 years ago, and the manufacturer and the US government is trying to hide that fact. If you look into the F-35's development, you'll find a long history of broken promises, disappointing performance metrics, and plenty of manufacturer and US military hiding these reports.

Honestly, if the jet was any good, I don't think the US government would be trying so hard to sell them.

@jhooper

I understand the point you're trying to make - I just don't understand why you're trying to make it. The A-10 is a low-altitude ground support aircraft, which is literally diametrically opposed to what Canada needs. We're not going to be strafing infantry on Ellesmere island. We need something that can patrol huge swaths of land and has excellent sensor and network capability. The A-10 is a slow tub designed to shoot things you can see with your own eyes.

As for the issues with the F-35, yes it's had problems, but find me a military procurement project of that scale that hasn't. The fact remains that it's very well suited for our needs, and the closest comparables are either a generation behind (European jets like Gripen, Rafale, etc.) or unobtainable/undesirable (J-20, Su-57)

I'm not 100% against buying Gripens instead if we can get them ASAP, but their useful life will be shorter.

@elasticsoul

@DavidM_yeg @elasticsoul @su_liam @troy_frizzell one still needs jets to patrol large areas (like our Arctic or Atlantic coasts). Had USA not shied from helping Ukraine, jets would have bombed every border entry point on day 1 on the 2022 war making it much harder for Russia to invade. Could have been Vee different war. War turned to drones because the west refused to give Ukraine the conventional weapons it needed.

@elasticsoul after threatening to invade Canada surely they’re not surprised that they don’t want to buy their planes?

@pedrobizbikedu @elasticsoul @EricLawton

Trust is more valuable than the dollar.

@elasticsoul Take the first batch which are coming off the production lines now, cancel the rest. Then go full-on with the Gripen.

This fulfills the NORAD commitment the nazi's are crying about.

@alessandro @jhooper

I honestly think that the F-35 should be ruled out on strategic grounds. It requires maintenance that only the US can do, the US cannot be trusted to keep them in the air on Canada’s behalf, and the US is currently the country most likely to invade Canada.

@elasticsoul oh... let's play this game:
"Because of the US tariffs, Canada has not enough money to buy F-35 Jets"
It makes no sense, but Trump does not make sense, so he will understand.

@De_Minimis

The thing is, would you trust the Americans to honour NORAD commitments themselves? Can the Americans be trusted to honour any agreements now? It seems clear the answer is no.

@jfmezei @DavidM_yeg @su_liam @troy_frizzell

The war turned to drones because they’re the most economical and useful, not because the West wouldn’t supply jets. I agree 100% with the above posters that drones - air, land, and sea - are the future. They’re vastly more economical, pilots can be trained far more quickly and cheaply, and they can and do take out bigger, expensive hardware. Canada should be partnering with Ukraine to build this tech in Canada.

@AnnieBuddy @pedrobizbikedu @EricLawton

100% correct. And now the Americans have done enough damage to themselves that it looks like the US Dollar is on its way out as the world’s reserve currency. The US is going to be a poorer nation for generations.

@elasticsoul @DavidM_yeg @su_liam @troy_frizzell I don't disagree about drones. But you still need jets to patrol large areas. You still need helicopters for search and rescue, or to drop troups off in an area.

Military is more than fighting a war.

However, if, at very start of the war, the west had provided air defense to bomb any Russians entering Ukraine at the border, the outcome of war would be different. Drones didn't yet exist, though the cruise missiles (glorified and expensive drones) did.

@elasticsoul @jfmezei @su_liam @troy_frizzell

I’m curious what a jet patrolling a large area accomplishes that other tools like satellites or surveillance and munitions drones can’t? (We weren’t talking about helicopters or cargo planes, just fighter jets)