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  3. Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

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lawenforcementmedicine
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  • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

    Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

    Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

    Esslar2F This user is from outside of this forum
    Esslar2F This user is from outside of this forum
    Esslar2
    wrote last edited by
    #6

    @mcnado This isn't AI, but my oncologist moved offices about ten years ago. I happened to see my records that had been transferred electronically. To my astonishment, the records stated that I had been using illegal drugs in the past. Right away, I got to my doctor and asked him how this untrue statement had got into my health records. He apologized and said sometimes people's records got "mixed up" when they were moved around electronically. This could have been quite a problem for me had I not caught it, because I was a professional pilot and had to get a letter from this doctor about my overall health every time I applied for a new medical certificate that allowed me to fly.

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

      The implication then, is if you are using AI reports or notes, you MUST proofread them line by line before submitting them to the official record. You are, after all, the one signing the note. You are the one who is staking your license/certification on the information being accurate. If the AI lied, and you sign their note, you are wrong. It’s like if I signed a medical student note without any corrections or hint that it was a medical student note, except that most students don’t hallucinate.

      *|FNAME|*C This user is from outside of this forum
      *|FNAME|*C This user is from outside of this forum
      *|FNAME|*
      wrote last edited by
      #7

      @mcnado
      Which begs the question: if you have to go through the output, line by line scanning for errors, is there really an efficiency gain to be had? 🤔

      People being people, there will be corners cut and there will be deaths/false convictions as a result. I just hope that accountability will fall on the people using these tools instead of on the tools themselves.

      Rupert V/R McNadoMDM 2 Replies Last reply
      0
      • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

        Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

        Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

        Joe BayesJ This user is from outside of this forum
        Joe BayesJ This user is from outside of this forum
        Joe Bayes
        wrote last edited by
        #8

        @mcnado Yes, isn't it great? They can put whatever lies they want in the report, and if they get caught then it's the AI's fault. Bring on the weaponized vehicles and agonizer gloves!

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

          Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

          Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

          TomWilsonYEGC This user is from outside of this forum
          TomWilsonYEGC This user is from outside of this forum
          TomWilsonYEG
          wrote last edited by
          #9

          @mcnado

          I think it important to understand why.

          AI reply engines are programmed to encourage user interaction. That means after an analysis of your input they will construct a reply that makes you feel good using the kind of language you use. Watch for the qualifiers: "excellent", Well done", etc.
          AI "makes up everything". Each instance is independent of previous ones outside your present "interaction". The engine parses your request to set up reply parameters then its database for answers and assigns each part a probability and a reply that is random phonemes is just as likely as a direct quote from a Supreme Court ruling.
          Ask for references and check them out.
          Ask for challenging replies that make you think. Again, they all need to be referenced.

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

            Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

            Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

            ? Offline
            ? Offline
            Guest
            wrote last edited by
            #10
            @mcnado Add this to your list of AI in medicine stories:
            https://ack.nerdfight.online/notice/B8ua5nQFDkBIcfpkbQ
            1 Reply Last reply
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            • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

              The implication then, is if you are using AI reports or notes, you MUST proofread them line by line before submitting them to the official record. You are, after all, the one signing the note. You are the one who is staking your license/certification on the information being accurate. If the AI lied, and you sign their note, you are wrong. It’s like if I signed a medical student note without any corrections or hint that it was a medical student note, except that most students don’t hallucinate.

              Ryan MR This user is from outside of this forum
              Ryan MR This user is from outside of this forum
              Ryan M
              wrote last edited by
              #11

              @mcnado The Pitt did a good job highlighting these problems with AI

              McNadoMDM 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

                The implication then, is if you are using AI reports or notes, you MUST proofread them line by line before submitting them to the official record. You are, after all, the one signing the note. You are the one who is staking your license/certification on the information being accurate. If the AI lied, and you sign their note, you are wrong. It’s like if I signed a medical student note without any corrections or hint that it was a medical student note, except that most students don’t hallucinate.

                KanaMaunaK This user is from outside of this forum
                KanaMaunaK This user is from outside of this forum
                KanaMauna
                wrote last edited by
                #12

                @mcnado Exactly. Last year I was on a large multiagency call regarding new Veteran Services grants. At the end someone sent out their AI notes and I compared it with my own notes. I had to email the group to let them know that not only had the assistant botched the discussion of complex claiming, anyone following them would probably be committing a federal crime.

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • *|FNAME|*C *|FNAME|*

                  @mcnado
                  Which begs the question: if you have to go through the output, line by line scanning for errors, is there really an efficiency gain to be had? 🤔

                  People being people, there will be corners cut and there will be deaths/false convictions as a result. I just hope that accountability will fall on the people using these tools instead of on the tools themselves.

                  Rupert V/R This user is from outside of this forum
                  Rupert V/R This user is from outside of this forum
                  Rupert V/
                  wrote last edited by
                  #13

                  @crispius @mcnado Humans are bad at monitoring processes that rarely go wrong. With the best will in the world, you cannot reliably review a hundred LLM generated documents a day and find the one line that doesn't match reality.

                  1 Reply Last reply
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                  • Darth OslerA Darth Osler

                    @mcnado *ahem*

                    While the lay term may be hallucinate, the precise term is confabulate

                    Rupert V/R This user is from outside of this forum
                    Rupert V/R This user is from outside of this forum
                    Rupert V/
                    wrote last edited by
                    #14

                    @autolycos @mcnado Thank you. To hallucinate, you must first have some perception of reality.

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

                      Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

                      Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

                      P This user is from outside of this forum
                      P This user is from outside of this forum
                      Passwordsarehard4
                      wrote last edited by
                      #15

                      @mcnado LLM’s have a success rate of 80%. That’s the same as the “pull out” method of birth control. Intelligent people don’t rely on these kinds of things for important decisions.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

                        Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

                        Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

                        Andi HA This user is from outside of this forum
                        Andi HA This user is from outside of this forum
                        Andi H
                        wrote last edited by
                        #16

                        @mcnado
                        Research papers written by AI contain references (because AI knows it has to include them), but it doesn't know they have to be real references... study analysing 2.5 million papers identified approximately 146,900 hallucinated citations in 2025 alone

                        drdr6262D 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

                          The implication then, is if you are using AI reports or notes, you MUST proofread them line by line before submitting them to the official record. You are, after all, the one signing the note. You are the one who is staking your license/certification on the information being accurate. If the AI lied, and you sign their note, you are wrong. It’s like if I signed a medical student note without any corrections or hint that it was a medical student note, except that most students don’t hallucinate.

                          garlandG This user is from outside of this forum
                          garlandG This user is from outside of this forum
                          garland
                          wrote last edited by
                          #17

                          @mcnado Yep. I suspect that if you’re actually progressing carefully, this AI note process is not actually faster than writing the report yourself. The human doctor just provides a sort of liability crumple zone to absorb lawsuits when the AI makes errors.

                          McNadoMDM 1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

                            The implication then, is if you are using AI reports or notes, you MUST proofread them line by line before submitting them to the official record. You are, after all, the one signing the note. You are the one who is staking your license/certification on the information being accurate. If the AI lied, and you sign their note, you are wrong. It’s like if I signed a medical student note without any corrections or hint that it was a medical student note, except that most students don’t hallucinate.

                            garlandG This user is from outside of this forum
                            garlandG This user is from outside of this forum
                            garland
                            wrote last edited by
                            #18

                            @mcnado I’m a radiologist so I’m writing reports all day. Actually generating the report is not the time consuming part of the process. What takes time is THINKING about the case.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

                              Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

                              Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

                              Toni AittoniemiG This user is from outside of this forum
                              Toni AittoniemiG This user is from outside of this forum
                              Toni Aittoniemi
                              wrote last edited by
                              #19

                              @mcnado Probabilistic computing has no place in high-trust sectors.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • garlandG garland

                                @mcnado Yep. I suspect that if you’re actually progressing carefully, this AI note process is not actually faster than writing the report yourself. The human doctor just provides a sort of liability crumple zone to absorb lawsuits when the AI makes errors.

                                McNadoMDM This user is from outside of this forum
                                McNadoMDM This user is from outside of this forum
                                McNadoMD
                                wrote last edited by
                                #20

                                @garland this.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • Ryan MR Ryan M

                                  @mcnado The Pitt did a good job highlighting these problems with AI

                                  McNadoMDM This user is from outside of this forum
                                  McNadoMDM This user is from outside of this forum
                                  McNadoMD
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #21

                                  @rpmik I can’t watch it. Jumped off the couch and fled the room. Too damn real.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • *|FNAME|*C *|FNAME|*

                                    @mcnado
                                    Which begs the question: if you have to go through the output, line by line scanning for errors, is there really an efficiency gain to be had? 🤔

                                    People being people, there will be corners cut and there will be deaths/false convictions as a result. I just hope that accountability will fall on the people using these tools instead of on the tools themselves.

                                    McNadoMDM This user is from outside of this forum
                                    McNadoMDM This user is from outside of this forum
                                    McNadoMD
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #22

                                    @crispius to actually proofread a note for me would take much longer than writing it.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • McNadoMDM McNadoMD

                                      Whether you are in #lawenforcement or #medicine it is imperative that you understand this simple concept: AI engines that write reports will put information in the report that the AI engine thinks is what you want to see in the report.

                                      Doesn’t matter if that information is true. Doesn’t matter if the referenced facts or events actually occurred, were discussed, or are present in the record. The engine will “hallucinate” — make it up entirely — whatever the engine decides fulfills the prompt.

                                      Misuse CaseM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      Misuse CaseM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      Misuse Case
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #23

                                      @mcnado For a while I saw ads on YouTube for AI note-taking apps where the narrator was talking about how they struggled to take notes in meetings and it was so much easier now.

                                      My view of this was that said narrator needed to learn proper note-taking skills. (One of my duties on my current job is taking notes for meetings related to an esoteric subject in a regulated industry.)

                                      PhilWillP 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • Darth OslerA Darth Osler

                                        @mcnado *ahem*

                                        While the lay term may be hallucinate, the precise term is confabulate

                                        drdr6262D This user is from outside of this forum
                                        drdr6262D This user is from outside of this forum
                                        drdr6262
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #24

                                        @autolycos @mcnado

                                        Thanks for this important correction. As any psychiatrist will agree, a 'hallucination' has a quite specific technical meaning that carries diagnostic weight. The correct term for AI producing nonsense is 'confabulate' which is also a psychopathology with diagnostic implications.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • Andi HA Andi H

                                          @mcnado
                                          Research papers written by AI contain references (because AI knows it has to include them), but it doesn't know they have to be real references... study analysing 2.5 million papers identified approximately 146,900 hallucinated citations in 2025 alone

                                          drdr6262D This user is from outside of this forum
                                          drdr6262D This user is from outside of this forum
                                          drdr6262
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #25

                                          @AH_99 @mcnado

                                          Lets be clear - the AI did not 'hallucinate'. It confabulated the invented referrences; no sensory processing mistake occurred. It doesn't (yet) have a sensory system.

                                          Andi HA CloudslaveC RaymondPierreL3R 3 Replies Last reply
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