Age Verification isn't a technical problem to solve.
-
@0x4d6165 The methods they use are terrible but it can be done safely, look at EU's proposed app which would make the government check your age, not random private companies. And the government would simply tell the website "yes" or "no", without any identifiable information. So the problem would not persist. It's also open source.
Would you still be against that? If so, why?
-
@0x4d6165 It's open source.
-
@0x4d6165 It means people can check the code and see what it really does. It's supposed to simply give a yes or no, nothing else. Or do you think this is still corruptable?
-
@0x4d6165 Very insightful...
-
@0x4d6165 There already are digital ID systems like EU's proposal that are implemented by governments around the world. For instance, Sweden has it ( y'know, one of the most progressive countries in the world ), so does Denmark, Canada, etc. I don't see how they affected negatively anyone in particular.
I don't see "basics of authoritarianism" anywhere in here like USA is doing, where they censor queerness and spread disinformation to control people.
-
Age Verification isn't a technical problem to solve. If you think that, you're missing the point.
It's a social problem used by authoritarian governments as an excuse for population control and censorship.
It's a fundamental attack on free speech and democracy.
It must not be accommodated.
It must be stopped.#MassSurveillance #AgeVerification #Privacy #Democracy #HumanRights
How to convince people of this though? My mother thinks that it's good to keep the children safe and we're not important enough for any authoritarian government to notice us. And that anyone who likes pornograpy is sick in the head. I can tell her "Uh, no," but that doesn't really accomplish anything... -
@Em0nM4stodon What do you think of age verification in bars before they give you the alcohol? Or age verification before they let you in a sex convention. /gen
@Azarilh Showing ID in person to another human is very different. It doesn't require to collect and keep a copy of it digitally, and therefore is an entirely different situation that isn't even comparable. It also doesn't gatekeep portals of information in the same way that digital age verification on the internet does.
-
@Azarilh Showing ID in person to another human is very different. It doesn't require to collect and keep a copy of it digitally, and therefore is an entirely different situation that isn't even comparable. It also doesn't gatekeep portals of information in the same way that digital age verification on the internet does.
@Em0nM4stodon What about an open source solution that doesn't collect anything, and it simply tells the website "yes" or "no"?
-
@0x4d6165 Just look up "sweden digital id".
We have eID here in Italy too, but it's not used for much.
-
@0x4d6165 There already are digital ID systems like EU's proposal that are implemented by governments around the world. For instance, Sweden has it ( y'know, one of the most progressive countries in the world ), so does Denmark, Canada, etc. I don't see how they affected negatively anyone in particular.
I don't see "basics of authoritarianism" anywhere in here like USA is doing, where they censor queerness and spread disinformation to control people.
@Azarilh is right that there are age verification mechanisms that fully protect privacy and prevent sites requiring age verification from knowing the real-world identity of the user.
They can even be designed to prevent the authority providing the age verification from knowing what sites it's requested for.
More about this here: https://www.newamerica.org/oti/briefs/exploring-privacy-preserving-age-verification/
I'm not a fan of online age verification, but if governments are going to require it, we should be demanding that it be done this way.
@0x4d6165@transfem.social -
@Em0nM4stodon
I agree. Besides using a VPN, are there ways to bollix up such a system?@serfdeweb People need to contact their representatives and complain loudly about it.
These legislations need to be repealed and prevented.
The political class needs to hear that citizens reject surveillance firmly, and the focus should be instead on creating platforms that are less addictive, more privacy-respectful, and safer for everyone, including adults.
The time to fight is now.
-
@0x4d6165 OK then. *plonk*
-
Age Verification isn't a technical problem to solve. If you think that, you're missing the point.
It's a social problem used by authoritarian governments as an excuse for population control and censorship.
It's a fundamental attack on free speech and democracy.
It must not be accommodated.
It must be stopped.#MassSurveillance #AgeVerification #Privacy #Democracy #HumanRights
It is all about surveillance. Protecting children from serious harm on the Internet involves stopped malicious adults accessing child services, not stopping children accessing adult services.
-
@Em0nM4stodon What about an open source solution that doesn't collect anything, and it simply tells the website "yes" or "no"?
@Azarilh There would still be a need for this open-source app to collect "something" in order to answer this question. When I say it's not possible, I do not say this lightly. I have been researching this issue for a very long time.
-
It is all about surveillance. Protecting children from serious harm on the Internet involves stopped malicious adults accessing child services, not stopping children accessing adult services.
-
I'd rather trust a senior IT engineer than someone that just shouts "authoritarianism".
I understand your distrust, but you are blowing it out of proportion. It is possible to design an infrastructure that is safe. The only concern now is how will they use it, what will they block behind ID checks, and that is more concerning and rightfully so.
But we can't outright ban ID checks either. I'd rather not have children get addicted to smoking at 10.
-
I'd rather trust a senior IT engineer than someone that just shouts "authoritarianism".
I understand your distrust, but you are blowing it out of proportion. It is possible to design an infrastructure that is safe. The only concern now is how will they use it, what will they block behind ID checks, and that is more concerning and rightfully so.
But we can't outright ban ID checks either. I'd rather not have children get addicted to smoking at 10.
And BTW, we already had ID checks for a very long time. The only difference with such infrastructure would be "safer".
Countries blocking social media to children is a different problem altogether, and i disagree with it for the most part.
Online shops can require your ID, so can video platforms like YouTube or CornHub. For official EU petitions, you need your eID to verify you are actually a EU citizen.
-
@Azarilh There would still be a need for this open-source app to collect "something" in order to answer this question. When I say it's not possible, I do not say this lightly. I have been researching this issue for a very long time.
RE: https://federate.social/@jik/116115336623105287
What about this person's response?
https://mastodon.social/@jik@federate.social/116115336650467751
-
@Azarilh There would still be a need for this open-source app to collect "something" in order to answer this question. When I say it's not possible, I do not say this lightly. I have been researching this issue for a very long time.
@Em0nM4stodon I appreciate the genuine conversation, by the way. I understand it can be a touchy topic for some.
-
@dalias@hachyderm.io But that's not gonna happen.
So next I at least don't want children to be confronted with this abuse.
The absolute minimum demand for technical changes to the internet I have is getting Do-Not-Track back. When set, platforms still must operate to its full extent but not perform any user behavior analysis for purposes such as content recommendation or targeted advertisement (they still should be allowed to track for abuse prevention but they must take and disclosure measures that such data is not used for any other purpose, not even used as training data for future AI models).@divVerent @dalias why isn't it going to happen?
We are in a bad spot now, but... the bubble is popping. A bubble that pretty much all of survailence capitalism is involved in.
Politically things are heating up.
The USA's control is also breaking across the world.
Pretty much all the major companies are involved with a single scandal that is shaking up leadership in several places.
People are actively pushing back against Ring and tearing down Flock cameras in a push agaiinst survailence capitalism.
With such a turbulant time, why couldn't we successfullly land in a space where abusive platforms are banned and a minimum standard of behavior is established?
